Drivers could face £70 fine from Poole camera car (From Thisisdorset)
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Drivers could face £70 fine from Poole camera car
9:10am Sunday 12th February 2012 in Latest By Diana Henderson
The camera car being deployed outside of a schools in Poole Buy this photo »
BUSY shopping areas of Poole are to be patrolled by a camera car and drivers who park illegally risk a fine.
Borough of Poole is using its camera car which, since September, has been focusing on patrolling and enforcing parking restrictions outside schools, in busy retail areas.
The £67,000 Citroen camera safety car, which uses GPS satellite technology and an infrared camera system, has been used at school zig zags, bus stop clearways and taxi bays.
In order to deal with traffic congestion in some of Poole’s busiest shopping streets, the marked camera car will now be used in roads where loading and waiting is prohibited.
“We have seen the camera car working really well in other areas and know that it’s a cost effective method of preventing serious accidents and solving the problem of dangerous parking,” said Cllr Xena Dion, cabinet portfolio holder for transportation.
Drivers contravening loading restrictions risk receiving a penalty charge notice of up to £70.
Images captured by the camera car instantly record an offence using Automatic Number Plate Recognition and the vehicle owner will receive a notice through the post within two weeks.
The camera car will begin patrolling loading bays from Monday.
The vehicle had a slow start in enforcing parking in Poole, handing out just 11 fines to illegally parked motorists between its launch last September and December.
This was in contrast to Bournemouth’s camera car which averaged 158 fines a month during its first year in operation.
Comments(52)
penhale
says...
9:49am Sun 12 Feb 12
I wonder if there's any more bright ideas in the pipe line to decimate the high streets of this country even further.
Tango Charlie
says...
10:04am Sun 12 Feb 12
spryte67 wrote:Someone needs a re-test.
I think your paragraph about loading bays is incorrect. The waiting time allowed on a loading bay is 10 minutes so this would be un-enforceable with a camera car for an instant penalty charge notice.
Please quote the highway code stating where this is allowed.
uvox44
says...
10:05am Sun 12 Feb 12
echo-reader
says...
10:20am Sun 12 Feb 12
Football banning order yob
says...
10:27am Sun 12 Feb 12
ShuttleX
says...
11:39am Sun 12 Feb 12
That part of the story could mean that the loading bays in questions have restrictions on them. ie, no loading between certain hours.
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Some loading bays are for heavy goods vehicles only, so a car would get a ticket.
Any vechiles can use a loading bay which has no restrictions on it, for the use of loading/unloading "heavy goods" The question of what is heavy is subjective. To a 18 year old body builder, a 10kilo bag of spuds is light, to a 70 year old pensioner, it is heavy. Generally speaking, anything over 25 kilos is deemed to be heavy.
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Anybody may stop in a loading bay, regardless of restrictions (except in city red zones) to allow passengers to board or alight. The time this may take is again subjective. Letting out your daughter to go dancing will take less time then having to get a wheelchair etc out of the boot first. It is deemed that anything over 10 minutes will be classed as parking/waiting. The driver must be with the vechile at all times. Added to that, if the photo clearly shows no passenger getting in or out, you will most likely lose an appeal using that as an excuse.
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It is always worth appealing a ticket if you feel you were using the bays in the correct context. If you were just popping into MacDonalds, then a big mac and fries does not constitute "heavy goods". It is amazing how many tickets get overturned. The Council rely on the fact that most people won't bother, thus making obscene amounts of money from tickets that should never have been issued.
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The story doesn't make it clear if Poole council also intend to use the car to ticket people parked on single/double yellow lines, where there is a no waiting rule. They would have to be careful in this case, as disabled drivers are entitled to park on both of these, without causing an obstruction, for up to three hours. If there was a pattern of giving tickets to disabled drivers who are legally parked, the Council could find itself getting sued in the courts. If it is only the loading bays that are being targeted, then disabled drivers are obliged to follow the same rules as everybody else.
.
speedy231278
says...
12:45pm Sun 12 Feb 12
s-pb2
says...
1:23pm Sun 12 Feb 12
H2o-hara
says...
1:38pm Sun 12 Feb 12
John T
says...
1:51pm Sun 12 Feb 12
Football banning order yob wrote:That's no way to talk about Cllr Xena Dion.
Just a cash cow..
Jetwasher
says...
2:02pm Sun 12 Feb 12
Was Charlie
says...
2:43pm Sun 12 Feb 12
EGHH
says...
2:46pm Sun 12 Feb 12
The Renegade Master
says...
2:48pm Sun 12 Feb 12
Not satisfied with hiking parking charges in the town to obscene levels, their new policy is to paint double yellow lines on every road that's anywhere near where people need to go to work or shop.
Personally, I will not venture anywhere near any of our local town centres to shop as it's easier and free to shop at Castlepoint, so is it any wonder that our town centres are dying when our local Councils are doing everything they can to deter people from visiting them.
Adrian XX
says...
3:00pm Sun 12 Feb 12
Not satisfied with hiking parking charges in the town to obscene levels
If you are going to park for more than an hour, I don't think the cost is any greater than it was, but the dropping of the one hour fee certainly stops people coming in for a quick shop. Parking at Asda is always an option too.
Castlepoint is actually quite a long way from Poole - you can't just drop in there.
Old Colonial
says...
4:32pm Sun 12 Feb 12
rayc
says...
4:41pm Sun 12 Feb 12
How many serious accidents were there in the 6 months prior to the car being introduced and how many since? How many of those that occured in the 6 months prior to the introduction of the car could have been prevented if the car happened tp be there when the accident occured?
I suspect the truth is that the car is a white elephant and is costing the council money to operate and the only way to try to get more income is via mission creep. I wonder if they will follow the example of Council's in London and start to enforce yellow box junctions which have been designed to catch even the most careful driver.
Arjay
says...
5:04pm Sun 12 Feb 12
They are designed to help make traffic safer, and/or flow more smoothly.
They have a legal status.
If you don't want a camera car fine? --- don't park where you shouldn't.
Simples!
upyourpipe
says...
5:11pm Sun 12 Feb 12
Arjay wrote:If as you say parking restrictions are there to make traffic safer of flow more easily I fail to see why blue badge holders can park where ever they like and sometimes dangerously.
I really don't believe that parking restriction markings were put there for fun -- or specifically for raising cash!
They are designed to help make traffic safer, and/or flow more smoothly.
They have a legal status.
If you don't want a camera car fine? --- don't park where you shouldn't.
Simples!
rayc
says...
5:21pm Sun 12 Feb 12
Arjay wrote:Do you really believe that every bit of yellow paint has been used in the interests of safety and traffic flow? It's strange that there was no parking allowed in the streets around the Barclays building but install meters and it is now safe to do so.
I really don't believe that parking restriction markings were put there for fun -- or specifically for raising cash! They are designed to help make traffic safer, and/or flow more smoothly. They have a legal status. If you don't want a camera car fine? --- don't park where you shouldn't. Simples!
Parking restrictions may not have been placed for fun but certainly for political purposes and to force motorists into pay car parks and at parking meters.
I do agree with one thing though and that is to fight back and ensure that the car makes no money from you.
I bet that over the coming months there will be further mission creep and different enforcement introduced e.g. yellow box junction enforcement.
djd
says...
6:48pm Sun 12 Feb 12
upyourpipe wrote:the handbook accompanying the Blue Badge tells holders they may park on double yellow lines for up to three hours where there is no loading restriction is in force.
Arjay wrote:If as you say parking restrictions are there to make traffic safer of flow more easily I fail to see why blue badge holders can park where ever they like and sometimes dangerously.
I really don't believe that parking restriction markings were put there for fun -- or specifically for raising cash!
They are designed to help make traffic safer, and/or flow more smoothly.
They have a legal status.
If you don't want a camera car fine? --- don't park where you shouldn't.
Simples!
It also clearly states that you must not park in a dangerous position or where you would cause obstruction.
If parking officers do not enforce the regulations, that is a cause for concern.
Bournefre
says...
6:51pm Sun 12 Feb 12
Simples.
jasoncc123
says...
7:23pm Sun 12 Feb 12
Mark_Jordan
says...
7:45pm Sun 12 Feb 12
rayc wrote:Yellow box junction enforcement...Yes please.
Arjay wrote:Do you really believe that every bit of yellow paint has been used in the interests of safety and traffic flow? It's strange that there was no parking allowed in the streets around the Barclays building but install meters and it is now safe to do so.
I really don't believe that parking restriction markings were put there for fun -- or specifically for raising cash! They are designed to help make traffic safer, and/or flow more smoothly. They have a legal status. If you don't want a camera car fine? --- don't park where you shouldn't. Simples!
Parking restrictions may not have been placed for fun but certainly for political purposes and to force motorists into pay car parks and at parking meters.
I do agree with one thing though and that is to fight back and ensure that the car makes no money from you.
I bet that over the coming months there will be further mission creep and different enforcement introduced e.g. yellow box junction enforcement.
At frizzell roundabout, coming from Lindsay Road, the amount of idiots that block it as the go towards Poole road in the direction of tesco is starting to become a joke.
Idiots...all of em
Arjay
says...
10:20pm Sun 12 Feb 12
Dish out a few fines for blocking those, report those in the press, and watch the junctions miraculously start to clear........
Simples.
uvox44
says...
10:37pm Sun 12 Feb 12
rayc
says...
11:23pm Sun 12 Feb 12
uvox44 wrote:I never said that I disagreed with them only that I forsee mission creep of the camera car to enforce them. Perhaps they will start with the Broadstone toast rack entrance one?
rayc-agree with your comments regarding yellow lines where they don't need to be , but not with your implication that yellow box markings are also not there with a good reason-they aren't to do with safety per se but are to definetly a good thing for traffic management , after all why block a junction for others just because you are too dopey or lazy to keep it clear when you can't go anywhere anyway?
Yellow box junctions may be there with good reason but it is well recorded that in London especially many are installed which stretch the regulations to the limit making it virtually impossible to comply with them without bringing traffic to a standstill. I'm sure there are none in our conurbation that are designed that way and that a normally competent driver would have no problem complying with them.
s-pb2
says...
12:05am Mon 13 Feb 12
rayc wrote:If you seriously think parking restrictions are made on a political basis as you state, and therefore the highways department are staffed by party political members, then i think you need to get out more as the lack of oxygen has affected you
Arjay wrote:Do you really believe that every bit of yellow paint has been used in the interests of safety and traffic flow? It's strange that there was no parking allowed in the streets around the Barclays building but install meters and it is now safe to do so.
I really don't believe that parking restriction markings were put there for fun -- or specifically for raising cash! They are designed to help make traffic safer, and/or flow more smoothly. They have a legal status. If you don't want a camera car fine? --- don't park where you shouldn't. Simples!
Parking restrictions may not have been placed for fun but certainly for political purposes and to force motorists into pay car parks and at parking meters.
I do agree with one thing though and that is to fight back and ensure that the car makes no money from you.
I bet that over the coming months there will be further mission creep and different enforcement introduced e.g. yellow box junction enforcement.
Jimboob1
says...
12:46am Mon 13 Feb 12
rayc
says...
9:02am Mon 13 Feb 12
Jimboob1 wrote:Poole Council say in their annual parking report;
Just what we all need. England is such a stupidly run country. Can't it be like spain where there are no stupid speed cameras and no stupid cars that montior you?
"Parking Policy- why is it important?
The parking service contributes to the wider transport aims and objectives as detailed in the Council’s Local Transport Plan 3 (LTP3). These LTP 3 objectives are:
Tackle climate change
Support economic growth
Promote equality of opportunity
Contribute to better safety, security and health
Improve quality of life"
Sounds political to me and far beyond ensuring there is a piece of tarmac to park on.
Mamma Troll
says...
9:38am Mon 13 Feb 12
Could! might, maybe, shoulda woulda coulda, non-story.
Phixer
says...
9:39am Mon 13 Feb 12
Bournefre wrote:So you don't believe in the democratic process of being innocent until proven guilty?
Simply send a £30 fine to anyone who parks in the connurbation on one particular day. The onus is then on the motorist to either pay within 14 days otherwise the fine rises to £60, or appeal after a second notice has been sent demanding £60. By Arjay's logic many motorists will assume they must have parked incorrectly which is why they got the fine and pay up, some motorists will cut their losses and pay the reduced £30 fine in case they have insufficient evidence to get the penalty cancelled, some will not receive the paperwork they need to appeal due to postal errors, and some will miss the deadline for appeal. If you haven't parked where you shouldn't or if an exception is allowed (eg for blue badge holders) the penalty will be cancelled on appeal so you won't have to pay a fine, just the cost of making the appeal.
Simples.
Or are you a local councillor?
live-and-let-live
says...
9:44am Mon 13 Feb 12
1 car
1 camera=£67,000
i would also like to know who supplied this car at such a high price and who ordered it and paid for it with our council tax.
mikey2gorgeous
says...
10:32am Mon 13 Feb 12
Jimboob1 wrote:Given they have roughly twice as many people killed or seriously injured on the roads as the UK... no thankyou!
Just what we all need. England is such a stupidly run country. Can't it be like spain where there are no stupid speed cameras and no stupid cars that montior you?
Cherry19
says...
2:57pm Mon 13 Feb 12
penhale
says...
3:38pm Mon 13 Feb 12
mikey2gorgeous wrote:Check the stats that you are so fond of and I think you'll find that road deaths in Spain have been decreasing over the last couple of years, in fact road deaths in Spain seem to be a quarter of the U.K.
Jimboob1 wrote:Given they have roughly twice as many people killed or seriously injured on the roads as the UK... no thankyou!
Just what we all need. England is such a stupidly run country. Can't it be like spain where there are no stupid speed cameras and no stupid cars that montior you?
paul.p
says...
5:20pm Mon 13 Feb 12
phonehome
says...
5:21pm Mon 13 Feb 12
Bournefre
says...
8:05pm Mon 13 Feb 12
Phixer wrote:Do you suppose a camera car believes in the democratic process, or do you think it might just go around indiscriminately issuing fines to every blue badge holder, delivery driver or lost tourist who has stopped to look at their map or program their sat nav? Again, the onus will be on the motorist to prove their innocence or pay up when they may have a genuine reason for stopping somewhere.
Bournefre wrote:So you don't believe in the democratic process of being innocent until proven guilty?
Simply send a £30 fine to anyone who parks in the connurbation on one particular day. The onus is then on the motorist to either pay within 14 days otherwise the fine rises to £60, or appeal after a second notice has been sent demanding £60. By Arjay's logic many motorists will assume they must have parked incorrectly which is why they got the fine and pay up, some motorists will cut their losses and pay the reduced £30 fine in case they have insufficient evidence to get the penalty cancelled, some will not receive the paperwork they need to appeal due to postal errors, and some will miss the deadline for appeal. If you haven't parked where you shouldn't or if an exception is allowed (eg for blue badge holders) the penalty will be cancelled on appeal so you won't have to pay a fine, just the cost of making the appeal.
Simples.
Or are you a local councillor?
I'm not a local councillor; are you?
ashleycross
says...
10:28pm Mon 13 Feb 12
speedy231278
says...
8:09am Tue 14 Feb 12
Tango Charlie
says...
8:14am Tue 14 Feb 12
upyourpipe wrote:They can't. They just think they can. Look up the regulations..
Arjay wrote:If as you say parking restrictions are there to make traffic safer of flow more easily I fail to see why blue badge holders can park where ever they like and sometimes dangerously.
I really don't believe that parking restriction markings were put there for fun -- or specifically for raising cash!
They are designed to help make traffic safer, and/or flow more smoothly.
They have a legal status.
If you don't want a camera car fine? --- don't park where you shouldn't.
Simples!
a.g.o.g.
says...
2:31pm Tue 14 Feb 12
rayc wrote:tackles climate change by making all drive around in ever increasing circles......
Jimboob1 wrote:Poole Council say in their annual parking report;
Just what we all need. England is such a stupidly run country. Can't it be like spain where there are no stupid speed cameras and no stupid cars that montior you?
"Parking Policy- why is it important?
The parking service contributes to the wider transport aims and objectives as detailed in the Council’s Local Transport Plan 3 (LTP3). These LTP 3 objectives are:
Tackle climate change
Support economic growth
Promote equality of opportunity
Contribute to better safety, security and health
Improve quality of life"
Sounds political to me and far beyond ensuring there is a piece of tarmac to park on.
John T
says...
4:15pm Tue 14 Feb 12
paul.p wrote:Poole Conservatives 'never forget it is your money they are spending.' ( Local Election leaflets 2007 and 2011)
Another example of wasting our Tax money, how dare they make the assumption that it's ok to do so.
bourne free
says...
9:45pm Tue 14 Feb 12
teenie
says...
10:01pm Tue 14 Feb 12
Roads around school gates should always be patrolled for child safety.
Drive throughs for banks are needed because drivers always want to park right outside a ATM machine!!
Harv1979
says...
2:14pm Wed 15 Feb 12
ashleycross wrote:I agree with the great job it has done around the schools in the area and that is what it should continue to do.
This car has done a great job of clearing the dangerous drivers out of the way of my son's school gates. I now feel he is much safer walking to school as he can see if a car is coming when he crosses the road just by the school gates. Previously the road markings were just ignored and it was impossible for a child to cross safely. I don't care how much it cost , my son is worth it. And if you don't feel protective towards little children then you are the reason we need cars like this one.I think it's really tragic that people care more about a fine than they care about children's safety.
Unfortunately, the indiscriminate nature of the camera car means it is unsuitable to monitor parking in the way that's being proposed.
rayc
says...
5:48pm Wed 15 Feb 12
Harv1979 wrote:The council have got the taste for income from Penalty Notices and there is no way that they will subsidise the car for enforcement of school parking. The scope of enforcement has got to be expanded to pay for the operation of the car and fund the core school protection reason for buying it.
ashleycross wrote: This car has done a great job of clearing the dangerous drivers out of the way of my son's school gates. I now feel he is much safer walking to school as he can see if a car is coming when he crosses the road just by the school gates. Previously the road markings were just ignored and it was impossible for a child to cross safely. I don't care how much it cost , my son is worth it. And if you don't feel protective towards little children then you are the reason we need cars like this one.I think it's really tragic that people care more about a fine than they care about children's safety.I agree with the great job it has done around the schools in the area and that is what it should continue to do. Unfortunately, the indiscriminate nature of the camera car means it is unsuitable to monitor parking in the way that's being proposed.
You may think that Councils value the safety of children but it is not at any cost.
BIGTONE
says...
7:18pm Wed 15 Feb 12
Oh its the Council....
Step this way Sir...Is your cheque book open?
soTired
says...
1:01pm Thu 16 Feb 12
Quote from George Orwell. 1984, Book 1, Chapter 1
aceofthebase
says...
12:11pm Fri 17 Feb 12
Why can the council use number plate recognition equipment? It's not a police state it's a council estate!
spryte67 says...
9:29am Sun 12 Feb 12