Gridlock: how can one accident cause so much chaos? (From Thisisdorset)

RivermeadMike wrote:
How can it possibly take three hours to clear the road. Typical police incompetence as usual! Whenever there is a road accident, the police seem to take a gung ho approach. Close the road for as long as possible and see how much chaos they can create. Let's hope the new PCC wil rein them in!

Brock_and_Roll wrote:
With my prejudiced hat on, a look at the photo above shows a hot hatch with gold allow wheels and blacked out windows. So I suspect the driver was a young male and speed played a big part in the smash!

A Lofty wrote:
Some years back, what had traditionally been known as a Road Traffic Accident was redefined in British law as a Road Traffic COLLISION. The reason: there is no such thing as an 'accident' on the road. Someone is ALWAYS to blame, whether it be 'tailgating', poor roadworthiness of vehicle etc etc. It sounds like everyone had a difficult morning but I am pretty sure that the police did not intentionally conspire to slow you all up. And you never know, it might be you that is involved in an RTC next time and, given the litigious society in which we now live, you will no doubt be slagging the police off if they have not gathered the relevant evidence properly that you will no doubt scurry away with to your 'no win no fee' representative. The police are not responsible for this mess, and they must be allowed to do their job properly. Anyway, you can expect an even longer wait in the future, as I read most days in the press that police numbers have been or are being reduced by 20%. Happy motoring. Alternatively, buy a bike!

the parsons nose wrote:
i think the surface of the Spur Road is in critical condition ,you can hear it under your tyres ,the surface makes cars skip and hop about ,if you follow them you can see it and theres no grip either so when a car breaks hard in front of another they just slide into whatever is ahead of them ,it has happened a lot this autumn ,that road should have been resurfaced three years ago when they said it was worn out ,it is now dangerous and should have a restricted speed limit , tailgating is a big problem and 100 mph on that road as many do late in the evening is near suicidal

ekimnoslen wrote:

the parsons nose wrote: i think the surface of the Spur Road is in critical condition ,you can hear it under your tyres ,the surface makes cars skip and hop about ,if you follow them you can see it and theres no grip either so when a car breaks hard in front of another they just slide into whatever is ahead of them ,it has happened a lot this autumn ,that road should have been resurfaced three years ago when they said it was worn out ,it is now dangerous and should have a restricted speed limit , tailgating is a big problem and 100 mph on that road as many do late in the evening is near suicidal

The main problems are excessive speed and tailgating. I suggest a speed limit of say 55mph as in most parts of the USA. There are far too many vehicles travel ling at excessive speeds knowing that the dire lack of police traffic patrols makes it unlikely that they will be caught. If you want the police to control this behavior give them the resources.

penhale wrote:

A Lofty wrote:
Some years back, what had traditionally been known as a Road Traffic Accident was redefined in British law as a Road Traffic COLLISION. The reason: there is no such thing as an 'accident' on the road. Someone is ALWAYS to blame, whether it be 'tailgating', poor roadworthiness of vehicle etc etc. It sounds like everyone had a difficult morning but I am pretty sure that the police did not intentionally conspire to slow you all up. And you never know, it might be you that is involved in an RTC next time and, given the litigious society in which we now live, you will no doubt be slagging the police off if they have not gathered the relevant evidence properly that you will no doubt scurry away with to your 'no win no fee' representative. The police are not responsible for this mess, and they must be allowed to do their job properly. Anyway, you can expect an even longer wait in the future, as I read most days in the press that police numbers have been or are being reduced by 20%. Happy motoring. Alternatively, buy a bike!

What a load of cobblers, of course some are accidents, it's not always down to poor driving or defective vehicles.

pd7 wrote:
Quite normal ,possible fire damage to surface .

Lots of the fluids in cars can break down a road surface .

Cars on fire are dangerous things you dont just put them out you have to inspoct them for hidden hot spots that can flare up again .

If they did not do all these checks some one would be moaning / suing he next day that a pot hole has destroyed a rim ... and maybe caused another accident.

Let them do the job , I am quite sure they would rather be back at base than playing with dangerous events and getting the wrath of people stuck in a jam.

Turn the engine off , put some nice music on , make a call that you will be late . ( car is stopped and engine off ) . Relax and listem to the music.

What ever happens you will be at home later with a DVD on and a cup of tea . Some poor person is in hospital or worse.

djd wrote:
Think about it before posting about police incompetence, unnecessary road closures, etc.
The accident happened at 6am, by the time the police, fire and ambulance had done whatever they had to do it was probably nearer to 7am.
The recovery company had to be called, they probably had to call their operative out from home, he probably had to collect the recovery truck from the yard. Look where the vehicle is, it's behind the barriers which means it probably needed a specialist recovery unit. The recovery unit them had to get from wherever it was to the scene. It then had to recover the vehicle safely. Perhaps when you take everything into consideration, it wasn't an unreasonable time.
Perhaps you would like to be dealing with this incident with traffic whizzing past you at 60-70mph. Not a nice experience.
At the end of the day the biggest problem is that there is literally nowhere for the traffic to go when an accident occurs on a road such as the A338.
Don't blame those who job it is to deal with the accident.

djd wrote:
Think about it before posting about police incompetence, unnecessary road closures, etc. The accident happened at 6am, by the time the police, fire and ambulance had done whatever they had to do it was probably nearer to 7am. The recovery company had to be called, they probably had to call their operative out from home, he probably had to collect the recovery truck from the yard. Look where the vehicle is, it's behind the barriers which means it probably needed a specialist recovery unit. The recovery unit them had to get from wherever it was to the scene. It then had to recover the vehicle safely. Perhaps when you take everything into consideration, it wasn't an unreasonable time. Perhaps you would like to be dealing with this incident with traffic whizzing past you at 60-70mph. Not a nice experience. At the end of the day the biggest problem is that there is literally nowhere for the traffic to go when an accident occurs on a road such as the A338. Don't blame those who job it is to deal with the accident.

A Lofty wrote:
Some years back, what had traditionally been known as a Road Traffic Accident was redefined in British law as a Road Traffic COLLISION. The reason: there is no such thing as an 'accident' on the road. Someone is ALWAYS to blame, whether it be 'tailgating', poor roadworthiness of vehicle etc etc. It sounds like everyone had a difficult morning but I am pretty sure that the police did not intentionally conspire to slow you all up. And you never know, it might be you that is involved in an RTC next time and, given the litigious society in which we now live, you will no doubt be slagging the police off if they have not gathered the relevant evidence properly that you will no doubt scurry away with to your 'no win no fee' representative. The police are not responsible for this mess, and they must be allowed to do their job properly. Anyway, you can expect an even longer wait in the future, as I read most days in the press that police numbers have been or are being reduced by 20%. Happy motoring. Alternatively, buy a bike!

throatwarbler wrote:

ekimnoslen wrote:

the parsons nose wrote: i think the surface of the Spur Road is in critical condition ,you can hear it under your tyres ,the surface makes cars skip and hop about ,if you follow them you can see it and theres no grip either so when a car breaks hard in front of another they just slide into whatever is ahead of them ,it has happened a lot this autumn ,that road should have been resurfaced three years ago when they said it was worn out ,it is now dangerous and should have a restricted speed limit , tailgating is a big problem and 100 mph on that road as many do late in the evening is near suicidal

The main problems are excessive speed and tailgating. I suggest a speed limit of say 55mph as in most parts of the USA. There are far too many vehicles travel ling at excessive speeds knowing that the dire lack of police traffic patrols makes it unlikely that they will be caught. If you want the police to control this behavior give them the resources.

while contributing to the overcrowding on the roads this morning i couldn't help noticing that there seemed to be a major problem with cars doing insuffcient speed relative to their lane choice.

Poor awareness and decision making should also be regarded as "main problems".

penhale wrote:

A Lofty wrote:
Some years back, what had traditionally been known as a Road Traffic Accident was redefined in British law as a Road Traffic COLLISION. The reason: there is no such thing as an 'accident' on the road. Someone is ALWAYS to blame, whether it be 'tailgating', poor roadworthiness of vehicle etc etc. It sounds like everyone had a difficult morning but I am pretty sure that the police did not intentionally conspire to slow you all up. And you never know, it might be you that is involved in an RTC next time and, given the litigious society in which we now live, you will no doubt be slagging the police off if they have not gathered the relevant evidence properly that you will no doubt scurry away with to your 'no win no fee' representative. The police are not responsible for this mess, and they must be allowed to do their job properly. Anyway, you can expect an even longer wait in the future, as I read most days in the press that police numbers have been or are being reduced by 20%. Happy motoring. Alternatively, buy a bike!

What a load of cobblers, of course some are accidents, it's not always down to poor driving or defective vehicles.

djd wrote:
Think about it before posting about police incompetence, unnecessary road closures, etc. The accident happened at 6am, by the time the police, fire and ambulance had done whatever they had to do it was probably nearer to 7am. The recovery company had to be called, they probably had to call their operative out from home, he probably had to collect the recovery truck from the yard. Look where the vehicle is, it's behind the barriers which means it probably needed a specialist recovery unit. The recovery unit them had to get from wherever it was to the scene. It then had to recover the vehicle safely. Perhaps when you take everything into consideration, it wasn't an unreasonable time. Perhaps you would like to be dealing with this incident with traffic whizzing past you at 60-70mph. Not a nice experience. At the end of the day the biggest problem is that there is literally nowhere for the traffic to go when an accident occurs on a road such as the A338. Don't blame those who job it is to deal with the accident.

Dont drop litter wrote:

throatwarbler wrote:

ekimnoslen wrote:

the parsons nose wrote: i think the surface of the Spur Road is in critical condition ,you can hear it under your tyres ,the surface makes cars skip and hop about ,if you follow them you can see it and theres no grip either so when a car breaks hard in front of another they just slide into whatever is ahead of them ,it has happened a lot this autumn ,that road should have been resurfaced three years ago when they said it was worn out ,it is now dangerous and should have a restricted speed limit , tailgating is a big problem and 100 mph on that road as many do late in the evening is near suicidal

The main problems are excessive speed and tailgating. I suggest a speed limit of say 55mph as in most parts of the USA. There are far too many vehicles travel ling at excessive speeds knowing that the dire lack of police traffic patrols makes it unlikely that they will be caught. If you want the police to control this behavior give them the resources.

while contributing to the overcrowding on the roads this morning i couldn't help noticing that there seemed to be a major problem with cars doing insuffcient speed relative to their lane choice. Poor awareness and decision making should also be regarded as "main problems".

"Insufficient speed relative to lane choice". What the hell does that mean? It sounds like there is someone else who needs to read the Highway Code again. The left hand lane is the correct lane - the other lanes are for passing. Speed has nothing to do with lane choice - you drive in the left hand lane unless you are passing slower traffic - then you go back to the left lane again.

muscliffman wrote:
The road here could easily have been cleared within an hour - probably a lot less. We need to understand exactly why this and similar situations now take so long to sort out before ignorantly knocking the emergency services.

Nevertheless this type of RTA now usually causes disruption way off the scale when compared to the original accident and the time that would be required to simply restore normality.

These long delays, often explained for 'safety' reasons, are in fact demonstrably achieving the precise opposite. It may also be 'box-ticking' dictats from 'on high' and potential litigation issues that are causing them.

Drivers caught up in long-term resultant jams take chances, create risks and have additional accidents. That is without all the other considerations arsing from the extended chaos.

Perhaps the new PCC (still no leaflets from any candidate - thanks for nothing) should urgently review this sort of RTA reaction. Because incidents like yesterdays are for certain a PR disaster and do make the Police seem very ineffectual, more than a little theatrical and actually in terms of public safety, counter productive.

muscliffman wrote:
The road here could easily have been cleared within an hour - probably a lot less. We need to understand exactly why this and similar situations now take so long to sort out before ignorantly knocking the emergency services.

Nevertheless this type of RTA now usually causes disruption way off the scale when compared to the original accident and the time that would be required to simply restore normality.

These long delays, often explained for 'safety' reasons, are in fact demonstrably achieving the precise opposite. It may also be 'box-ticking' dictats from 'on high' and potential litigation issues that are causing them.

Drivers caught up in long-term resultant jams take chances, create risks and have additional accidents. That is without all the other considerations arsing from the extended chaos.

Perhaps the new PCC (still no leaflets from any candidate - thanks for nothing) should urgently review this sort of RTA reaction. Because incidents like yesterdays are for certain a PR disaster and do make the Police seem very ineffectual, more than a little theatrical and actually in terms of public safety, counter productive.

ekimnoslen wrote:

the parsons nose wrote:
i think the surface of the Spur Road is in critical condition ,you can hear it under your tyres ,the surface makes cars skip and hop about ,if you follow them you can see it and theres no grip either so when a car breaks hard in front of another they just slide into whatever is ahead of them ,it has happened a lot this autumn ,that road should have been resurfaced three years ago when they said it was worn out ,it is now dangerous and should have a restricted speed limit , tailgating is a big problem and 100 mph on that road as many do late in the evening is near suicidal

The main problems are excessive speed and tailgating. I suggest a speed limit of say 55mph as in most parts of the USA. There are far too many vehicles travel ling at excessive speeds knowing that the dire lack of police traffic patrols makes it unlikely that they will be caught.
If you want the police to control this behavior give them the resources.

Mynameisme wrote:

penhale wrote:

A Lofty wrote:
Some years back, what had traditionally been known as a Road Traffic Accident was redefined in British law as a Road Traffic COLLISION. The reason: there is no such thing as an 'accident' on the road. Someone is ALWAYS to blame, whether it be 'tailgating', poor roadworthiness of vehicle etc etc. It sounds like everyone had a difficult morning but I am pretty sure that the police did not intentionally conspire to slow you all up. And you never know, it might be you that is involved in an RTC next time and, given the litigious society in which we now live, you will no doubt be slagging the police off if they have not gathered the relevant evidence properly that you will no doubt scurry away with to your 'no win no fee' representative. The police are not responsible for this mess, and they must be allowed to do their job properly. Anyway, you can expect an even longer wait in the future, as I read most days in the press that police numbers have been or are being reduced by 20%. Happy motoring. Alternatively, buy a bike!

What a load of cobblers, of course some are accidents, it's not always down to poor driving or defective vehicles.

He is actually correct.....that is the reason why it was changed from RTA to RTC......there is always someone/something to blame!

Dont drop litter wrote:

throatwarbler wrote:

ekimnoslen wrote:

the parsons nose wrote: i think the surface of the Spur Road is in critical condition ,you can hear it under your tyres ,the surface makes cars skip and hop about ,if you follow them you can see it and theres no grip either so when a car breaks hard in front of another they just slide into whatever is ahead of them ,it has happened a lot this autumn ,that road should have been resurfaced three years ago when they said it was worn out ,it is now dangerous and should have a restricted speed limit , tailgating is a big problem and 100 mph on that road as many do late in the evening is near suicidal

The main problems are excessive speed and tailgating. I suggest a speed limit of say 55mph as in most parts of the USA. There are far too many vehicles travel ling at excessive speeds knowing that the dire lack of police traffic patrols makes it unlikely that they will be caught. If you want the police to control this behavior give them the resources.

while contributing to the overcrowding on the roads this morning i couldn't help noticing that there seemed to be a major problem with cars doing insuffcient speed relative to their lane choice.

Poor awareness and decision making should also be regarded as "main problems".

"Insufficient speed relative to lane choice". What the hell does that mean? It sounds like there is someone else who needs to read the Highway Code again. The left hand lane is the correct lane - the other lanes are for passing. Speed has nothing to do with lane choice - you drive in the left hand lane unless you are passing slower traffic - then you go back to the left lane again.

notapeopleperson wrote:
love the fact that everyone on here seems to be an expert on road traffic law and RTC investigation, all of you sit there slagging the emergency services off just because you were a bit late for your crappy office job, I bet half the people on here wouldn't last a day in any of the emergency services away from the safety of your chair and desk, Bournemouth is full of people that think they could do better than the people trained to do that job, bunch of muppets

jobsworthwatch wrote:
Suspect it's not the accident that caused the chaos but the police treating the site of the accident as a crime scene in order to attribute blame. Never mind the cost to the economy and those that are trying to go about their business and never mind the carbon foot print of all those idling engines.
Top priority should be to attend to any injuries, get the debris of the road and get things moving as quickly as possible!

gileto wrote:

djd wrote:
Think about it before posting about police incompetence, unnecessary road closures, etc.
The accident happened at 6am, by the time the police, fire and ambulance had done whatever they had to do it was probably nearer to 7am.
The recovery company had to be called, they probably had to call their operative out from home, he probably had to collect the recovery truck from the yard. Look where the vehicle is, it's behind the barriers which means it probably needed a specialist recovery unit. The recovery unit them had to get from wherever it was to the scene. It then had to recover the vehicle safely. Perhaps when you take everything into consideration, it wasn't an unreasonable time.
Perhaps you would like to be dealing with this incident with traffic whizzing past you at 60-70mph. Not a nice experience.
At the end of the day the biggest problem is that there is literally nowhere for the traffic to go when an accident occurs on a road such as the A338.
Don't blame those who job it is to deal with the accident.

Whilst I don't understand how a car could have 'flipped into a field, rolled several times on to the carriageway' - it left the carraigeway rolled several times and then rejoined it??Anyone?? - as djd said the car was BEHIND the barrier so why wasn't recovery postponed until the middle of the day/early afternoon, when the road would have been much quieter and diversionary routes much easier too??

Dont drop litter wrote:

penhale wrote:

A Lofty wrote:
Some years back, what had traditionally been known as a Road Traffic Accident was redefined in British law as a Road Traffic COLLISION. The reason: there is no such thing as an 'accident' on the road. Someone is ALWAYS to blame, whether it be 'tailgating', poor roadworthiness of vehicle etc etc. It sounds like everyone had a difficult morning but I am pretty sure that the police did not intentionally conspire to slow you all up. And you never know, it might be you that is involved in an RTC next time and, given the litigious society in which we now live, you will no doubt be slagging the police off if they have not gathered the relevant evidence properly that you will no doubt scurry away with to your 'no win no fee' representative. The police are not responsible for this mess, and they must be allowed to do their job properly. Anyway, you can expect an even longer wait in the future, as I read most days in the press that police numbers have been or are being reduced by 20%. Happy motoring. Alternatively, buy a bike!

What a load of cobblers, of course some are accidents, it's not always down to poor driving or defective vehicles.

Wrong again penhale. Like I said before, get a copy of the Highway Code and read it again.
Road collisions always have a cause; that could be worn tyres, falling asleep, being drunk. Driving too fast (not necessarily breaking the speed limit) where conditions don't allow; dark, foggy, congested, icy are all considerations. If you drive too close, too fast on congested streets you have failed to access the conditions correctly and could be to blame if you crash.
It sounds to me as if the driver was going too fast or not paying attention. Odd that he was 'thrown clear' too...not wearing a seat bealt possibly?

The irate commuter wrote:
Ban all Audi & BMW driver to start with ...
Then all 'yoofs' in their Citreon Saxo's
Then anyone who fits a larger exhaust on their car
Then everyone who thinks it clever to driver with music full blast with all their windows down even in middle of winter.

There you go all sorted !!

penhale wrote:

RivermeadMike wrote:
How can it possibly take three hours to clear the road. Typical police incompetence as usual! Whenever there is a road accident, the police seem to take a gung ho approach. Close the road for as long as possible and see how much chaos they can create. Let's hope the new PCC wil rein them in!

Probably because every accident is viewed as another way of raising revenue by way of proving beyond a doubt that a driver had been doing something illegally.
Unlike other countries whose main priority is to reopen a vital road link as quickly as possible this country decides to call in vast amounts of agencies plus Sherlock Holmes just to elicit blame and stuff the consequences, the overkill at some accidents is madness.

Phixer wrote:
"Paramedics assessed him before he was taken to Poole General Hospital." Incedible! They could have walked him across the road to a 24hr A&E. What are our public servants thinking??

the smiling assassin wrote:

Phixer wrote:
"Paramedics assessed him before he was taken to Poole General Hospital." Incedible! They could have walked him across the road to a 24hr A&E. What are our public servants thinking??

What you are obviously unaware of is the fact that the main trauma care centre for east dorset (and bournemouth & poole) is at Poole Hospital. Although there is a 24hr A&E service at Bournemouth it doesn't have the skilled team necessary to treat really serious injuries. That meant to ensure that the patient got the best possible treatment he had to be taken to Poole A&E.

Heres a tip: If you happen to live close to Bournemouth hopsital just watch the number of blue lights that go straight past it towards Poole!!

dorsetspeed wrote:
Dibbles, not everyone would have been listening to the right radio station, etc. Even if they did, with "gridlock", it may be difficult to know which is the best road to try. And in any case, if they do choose the wrong route, it doesn't make it right that the road is closed any longer than necessary.

Dibbles2 wrote:

dorsetspeed wrote:
Dibbles, not everyone would have been listening to the right radio station, etc. Even if they did, with "gridlock", it may be difficult to know which is the best road to try. And in any case, if they do choose the wrong route, it doesn't make it right that the road is closed any longer than necessary.

Then when they realised there was a problem why didnt they switch to a local channel? Its not rocket science is it?

RivermeadMike wrote:
How can it possibly take three hours to clear the road. Typical police incompetence as usual! Whenever there is a road accident, the police seem to take a gung ho approach. Close the road for as long as possible and see how much chaos they can create. Let's hope the new PCC wil rein them in!

penhale wrote:

Dont drop litter wrote:

penhale wrote:

A Lofty wrote:
Some years back, what had traditionally been known as a Road Traffic Accident was redefined in British law as a Road Traffic COLLISION. The reason: there is no such thing as an 'accident' on the road. Someone is ALWAYS to blame, whether it be 'tailgating', poor roadworthiness of vehicle etc etc. It sounds like everyone had a difficult morning but I am pretty sure that the police did not intentionally conspire to slow you all up. And you never know, it might be you that is involved in an RTC next time and, given the litigious society in which we now live, you will no doubt be slagging the police off if they have not gathered the relevant evidence properly that you will no doubt scurry away with to your 'no win no fee' representative. The police are not responsible for this mess, and they must be allowed to do their job properly. Anyway, you can expect an even longer wait in the future, as I read most days in the press that police numbers have been or are being reduced by 20%. Happy motoring. Alternatively, buy a bike!

What a load of cobblers, of course some are accidents, it's not always down to poor driving or defective vehicles.

Wrong again penhale. Like I said before, get a copy of the Highway Code and read it again.
Road collisions always have a cause; that could be worn tyres, falling asleep, being drunk. Driving too fast (not necessarily breaking the speed limit) where conditions don't allow; dark, foggy, congested, icy are all considerations. If you drive too close, too fast on congested streets you have failed to access the conditions correctly and could be to blame if you crash.
It sounds to me as if the driver was going too fast or not paying attention. Odd that he was 'thrown clear' too...not wearing a seat bealt possibly?

Stuff the highway code, what about hitting a deep pothole, animals running across the road such as deer, broken or missing drain hole covers, rubbish thrown in the road, fallen trees , glass in the road, all of these and more can cause a serious accident which is not the drivers or vehicles fault, logically there is always something or someone at fault before an accident occurs but I have yet to see a badger, deer or hedgehog arrested or a tree, wheelie bin or a glass bottle taken into custody for causing an accident.