Licensed for a gun – at 10
CHILDREN as young as 10 have been issued with shotgun licences by Dorset Police.
More than 100 licences for guns have been issued to young people under 18 in the last two years.
These include shotgun licences to a 10-year-old, an 11-year-old, two 12-year-olds and six 13-year-olds.
Licences for rifles have been issued to two 15-year-olds, two 16-year-olds and ten 17-year-olds.
In total over the last three years 89 licences for shotguns and 14 firearm licences for rifles have been issued to people under the voting age.
The Daily Echo obtained these figures under the Freedom of Information Act but the police refused to say where in the county the licences were issued.
There is no minimum age to obtain a shotgun licence but police have to check the youngster is not a danger to the public safety or the peace and that they have a good reason for possessing a weapon. According to the police website, use for sport or pest control can constitute a good reason.
Shooting is growing in popularity for young people according to the British Association for Shooting and Conservation. Senior firearms officer for the association Mike Everleigh said he served as a policeman for 32 years, some of that time as an armed officer. He thinks allowing children to use legal weapons is a good thing.
He said: "Children are initially attracted to shooting because of what they see in films but they very quickly see that shooting is nothing like that.
"Children learn the responsibility that comes with the power of a gun. They also learn techniques to calm down because it is impossible to shoot well if you are excited or angry."
Graham Brown, owner of the Purbeck Shooting School, which teaches clay target shooting, agreed.
He said: "We teach children as young as seven and often the children who are properly taught are safer with the guns than some of the adults."
Shooting is taught at schools in the area. At Sherborne School boys do clay pigeon shooting and the school also has a shooting range.
7:00pm Friday 1st February 2008
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CommentPosted by: Vikki27, Poole on 7:23pm Fri 1 Feb 08
This has really shocked me.
Not to detract from the youths who can be trusted to use such weaponry for harmless activities such as clay pigeon shooting, but this iss ridiculous. Children under the age of 16/18 cannot legally purchase cigarettes or alcohol, respectively, both of which generally endanger only themselves. However, they are legally allowed to obtain a license to hold a potentially dangerous weapon that could be used to harm countless people??
Surely it would make more sense, with youths today becoming more comfortable with knives and guns as weapons, to increase the licensing age to 18?
This has really shocked me.
Not to detract from the youths who can be trusted to use such weaponry for harmless activities such as clay pigeon shooting, but this iss ridiculous. Children under the age of 16/18 cannot legally purchase cigarettes or alcohol, respectively, both of which generally endanger only themselves. However, they are legally allowed to obtain a license to hold a potentially dangerous weapon that could be used to harm countless people??
Surely it would make more sense, with youths today becoming more comfortable with knives and guns as weapons, to increase the licensing age to 18?
Posted by: PETE WOODLEY on 7:49pm Fri 1 Feb 08
This is quite frightening.What does the chief constable think,i am sure it must worry a lot of police officers.
This is quite frightening.What does the chief constable think,i am sure it must worry a lot of police officers.
Posted by: Tony, South West on 7:55pm Fri 1 Feb 08
Vikki27. Most if not all have to,(depending on the age) an adult present at any shoot or practice range,these fire arms have stringent rules and are checked as far as I know by a visit to the home by a fire arms inspector at various times,what about the people that own a car or a vehicle of some description, are they not classed as lethal in the wrong hands.
Vikki27. Most if not all have to,(depending on the age) an adult present at any shoot or practice range,these fire arms have stringent rules and are checked as far as I know by a visit to the home by a fire arms inspector at various times,what about the people that own a car or a vehicle of some description, are they not classed as lethal in the wrong hands.
Posted by: Nick, Bournemouth on 8:28pm Fri 1 Feb 08
[bold]Please do not link sport with crime.[/bold]
I have been shooting since I first joined a gun club at 12. I had a Firearms licence at 14. I represented Great Britain at 16. I won the Queens Medal (top 25 shots in the army) at 17. Passed my Sniper course at 18. Represented the army throughout my military career. Moved to Germany when the pistol ban started in 97.
Came first in the German County Championships in 2000 and shot in the German Masters in 2001.
[bold](My shooting skills also saved my life more than once while in the army).[/bold]
I no longer hold any live firearms having to sell them to return to GB. [bold]For me target pistol shooting was a particular skill that focused ALL of my concentration.[/bold] I had to control my whole body while ignoring all that went on around me. Before anyone decides that all shooters are criminals I can tell you it is not true. Many shooters are over 80 years old.
[italic]Please note: I have NEVER felt the inclination to rob a bank, do a drive by shooting, or hold up a shop.[/italic]
Please do not link sport with crime.
I have been shooting since I first joined a gun club at 12. I had a Firearms licence at 14. I represented Great Britain at 16. I won the Queens Medal (top 25 shots in the army) at 17. Passed my Sniper course at 18. Represented the army throughout my military career. Moved to Germany when the pistol ban started in 97.
Came first in the German County Championships in 2000 and shot in the German Masters in 2001.
(My shooting skills also saved my life more than once while in the army).
I no longer hold any live firearms having to sell them to return to GB.
For me target pistol shooting was a particular skill that focused ALL of my concentration. I had to control my whole body while ignoring all that went on around me. Before anyone decides that all shooters are criminals I can tell you it is not true. Many shooters are over 80 years old.
Please note: I have NEVER felt the inclination to rob a bank, do a drive by shooting, or hold up a shop. Posted by: Nick, Bournemouth on 8:32pm Fri 1 Feb 08
Oh, I forgot.
You can also hold a Private Pilots Licence at 10 years old.
Crashing a plane into a town would be dangerous but, believe it or not, there are many pilots who also manage to avoid doing this.
Oh, I forgot.
You can also hold a Private Pilots Licence at 10 years old.
Crashing a plane into a town would be dangerous but, believe it or not, there are many pilots who also manage to avoid doing this.
Posted by: ninelykstort, Bournemouth on 11:38pm Fri 1 Feb 08
[quote][bold]PETE WOODLEY[/bold] wrote:
This is quite frightening.What does the chief constable think,i am sure it must worry a lot of police officers.[/quote] You are absolutley right - what on earth are dorset polioce thinking!
PETE WOODLEY wrote:
This is quite frightening.What does the chief constable think,i am sure it must worry a lot of police officers.
You are absolutley right - what on earth are dorset polioce thinking!
Posted by: Nick, Bournemouth on 1:20am Sat 2 Feb 08
I can tell you what I believe he thinks.
If there is no legitimate reason to refuse a FAC or Shotgun Certificate then legal ground has he to refuse?
To carry a gun in Germany (in the employ of the army)I had to undergo a Psychiatric test.
To hold a Private FAC (Firearm Certificate) I had to pass a written test in the law. [bold]But then again I had to do the same for a Fishing Licence too!……[/bold]
Before Dunblane there was a shooting in a school in France that never made the news in the UK. The reason why?
The French police said that you can not control a madman. Which is true, but not what the press would like to believe.
While I held a FAC I was offered a revolver for sale in a pub in Bournemouth town centre. It was the same model that I had purchased for target shooting and it was for sale off licence for cheaper that I bought mine for.
You can not keep guns out of the hands of people who want them.
Surely it is better to let people use them in a safe, controlled environment?
I can tell you what I believe he thinks.
If there is no legitimate reason to refuse a FAC or Shotgun Certificate then legal ground has he to refuse?
To carry a gun in Germany (in the employ of the army)I had to undergo a Psychiatric test.
To hold a Private FAC (Firearm Certificate) I had to pass a written test in the law.
But then again I had to do the same for a Fishing Licence too!……
Before Dunblane there was a shooting in a school in France that never made the news in the UK. The reason why?
The French police said that you can not control a madman. Which is true, but not what the press would like to believe.
While I held a FAC I was offered a revolver for sale in a pub in Bournemouth town centre. It was the same model that I had purchased for target shooting and it was for sale off licence for cheaper that I bought mine for.
You can not keep guns out of the hands of people who want them.
Surely it is better to let people use them in a safe, controlled environment?
Posted by: sailor, Enbury Park on 1:33am Sat 2 Feb 08
Being ex armed forces myself, I have to agree with Nick completely. I have also worked with 10-18 year olds in a youth organisation which has target shooting as part of its training. All completely controlled.
Reading the news report above, I think it stands to reason, and I hope I am right that these licences were issued under the Police Laws regarding the issuing of licences, and that these under 18s are in an environment of where a gun is part of the life of where they live. By this I mean that the carry out the sport of Clay Pigeon Shooting, they shoot on their own land, they belong to a gun club, etc etc.
What we must also realise is this. If an incident involving a shooting took place in and around that area, licenced guns would be the first to be investigated, as well as the owners as a means of illimination or involvement.
Being ex armed forces myself, I have to agree with Nick completely. I have also worked with 10-18 year olds in a youth organisation which has target shooting as part of its training. All completely controlled.
Reading the news report above, I think it stands to reason, and I hope I am right that these licences were issued under the Police Laws regarding the issuing of licences, and that these under 18s are in an environment of where a gun is part of the life of where they live. By this I mean that the carry out the sport of Clay Pigeon Shooting, they shoot on their own land, they belong to a gun club, etc etc.
What we must also realise is this. If an incident involving a shooting took place in and around that area, licenced guns would be the first to be investigated, as well as the owners as a means of illimination or involvement.
Posted by: 2Much, New Forest on 10:07am Sat 2 Feb 08
Kids who are granted a license aren't done so willy-nilly. They would be properly supervised and taught to respect the weapon? I think it's more shocking that they let a 17yr old behind the wheel of a car with minimal training.
Kids who are granted a license aren't done so willy-nilly. They would be properly supervised and taught to respect the weapon? I think it's more shocking that they let a 17yr old behind the wheel of a car with minimal training.
Posted by: ALL SEEING EYE, POOLE on 12:16pm Sat 2 Feb 08
[bold]So do all the bad kids shooting other kids have gun licences? I think not and do the joy riders apply for licences before they steal a car - again I think not. [/bold]
So do all the bad kids shooting other kids have gun licences? I think not and do the joy riders apply for licences before they steal a car - again I think not. Posted by: 2Much, New Forest on 1:43pm Sat 2 Feb 08
No...all the bad kids don't have a license..but this is a controlled environment. So...all seeing eye..i get your point..[bold]i think not![/bold]
No...all the bad kids don't have a license..but this is a controlled environment. So...all seeing eye..i get your point..
i think not! Posted by: Jerry, poole, dorset on 10:30pm Sat 2 Feb 08
[quote][bold]ninelykstort[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]PETE WOODLEY[/bold] wrote: This is quite frightening.What does the chief constable think,i am sure it must worry a lot of police officers.[/quote] You are absolutley right - what on earth are dorset polioce thinking![/quote] Dorset Police are following the letter of the law, that's what they are "thinking".
If something is legal, and any application for firearms or shotgun licensing is no exception, the Police have no alternative but tomply with the letter of the law.
Having a license does not mean they can purchase a shotgun, they can only do this at the age of 18. Up to the age of 16, children may only use a shotgun under the supervision of someone over 21. They may be "given" one at the age of 16.
Please don't try and villify Dorset Police for doing their job. Check the internet for facts, it is not just Dorset.
ninelykstort wrote:
PETE WOODLEY wrote: This is quite frightening.What does the chief constable think,i am sure it must worry a lot of police officers.
You are absolutley right - what on earth are dorset polioce thinking!
Dorset Police are following the letter of the law, that's what they are "thinking".
If something is legal, and any application for firearms or shotgun licensing is no exception, the Police have no alternative but tomply with the letter of the law.
Having a license does not mean they can purchase a shotgun, they can only do this at the age of 18. Up to the age of 16, children may only use a shotgun under the supervision of someone over 21. They may be "given" one at the age of 16.
Please don't try and villify Dorset Police for doing their job. Check the internet for facts, it is not just Dorset.
Posted by: ALL SEEING EYE, POOLE on 10:31pm Sat 2 Feb 08
[quote][bold]2Much[/bold] wrote:
No...all the bad kids don't have a license..but this is a controlled environment. So...all seeing eye..i get your point..[bold]i think not![/bold] [/quote] [bold]What on earth are you trying to say? You seem to be very confused. Sober up and then explain.[/bold]
2Much wrote:
No...all the bad kids don't have a license..but this is a controlled environment. So...all seeing eye..i get your point..i think not!
What on earth are you trying to say? You seem to be very confused. Sober up and then explain. Posted by: Jerry, poole, dorset on 10:43pm Sat 2 Feb 08
[quote][bold]ALL SEEING EYE[/bold] wrote:
[bold]So do all the bad kids shooting other kids have gun licences? I think not and do the joy riders apply for licences before they steal a car - again I think not. [/bold] [/quote] Exactly, the BAD KIDS do not have licenses. Legitimate license holders are the first to be investigated when an armed incident occurs. However, most of the "Bad Kid" shootings involve handguns.
Hand guns are not licensed because (with certain exceptions) they were banned by Law around 1999. Therefore, any shooting incident involving handguns would be by persons using illegally held weapons. And you don't need a license to do that!
I don't think you can apply the same logic to joyriders. Many, but I admit, not all, probably [bold]DO[/bold] have licenses to drive.
ALL SEEING EYE wrote:
So do all the bad kids shooting other kids have gun licences? I think not and do the joy riders apply for licences before they steal a car - again I think not.
Exactly, the BAD KIDS do not have licenses. Legitimate license holders are the first to be investigated when an armed incident occurs. However, most of the "Bad Kid" shootings involve handguns.
Hand guns are not licensed because (with certain exceptions) they were banned by Law around 1999. Therefore, any shooting incident involving handguns would be by persons using illegally held weapons. And you don't need a license to do that!
I don't think you can apply the same logic to joyriders. Many, but I admit, not all, probably
DO have licenses to drive.
Posted by: roch1993, bournemouth on 4:54pm Sun 3 Feb 08
Hey i am a 14 year old curenty from bournemouth and i thing it is terribal that children as young as ten that carnt got o shops to buy acohel or byu fags till there 18 has been given the right to have a posesionof a gun.
i am not a fan of guns and that is not the reason i am not fond of guns but if u think it acturly is not good cause they could acserdently shot the rong thing bb guns yeh nothing els thanks byex[/bold]
Hey i am a 14 year old curenty from bournemouth and i thing it is terribal that children as young as ten that carnt got o shops to buy acohel or byu fags till there 18 has been given the right to have a posesionof a gun.
i am not a fan of guns and that is not the reason i am not fond of guns but if u think it acturly is not good cause they could acserdently shot the rong thing bb guns yeh nothing els thanks byex
Posted by: john_screech, bournemouth on 10:57am Mon 4 Feb 08
"This is quite frightening"?
In what way?
Far better that kids are taught from an early age to respect firearms and learn to handle them safely.
I think you'll also find that shooting has one of the lowest accident rates of any participation sport. That doesn't happen by chance.
What is quite frightening is the alarmist and sensationalist reporting shown here. This report clearly fails to mention that anyone under the age of 15 may be granted a shotgun licence but the use of which must be supervised by someone over the age of 21.
The implication in this report is that a youngster can go out and get his or herself a gun and use it where ever and whenever they like.
That is clearly not the case.
"This is quite frightening"?
In what way?
Far better that kids are taught from an early age to respect firearms and learn to handle them safely.
I think you'll also find that shooting has one of the lowest accident rates of any participation sport. That doesn't happen by chance.
What is quite frightening is the alarmist and sensationalist reporting shown here. This report clearly fails to mention that anyone under the age of 15 may be granted a shotgun licence but the use of which must be supervised by someone over the age of 21.
The implication in this report is that a youngster can go out and get his or herself a gun and use it where ever and whenever they like.
That is clearly not the case.
Posted by: Sarah Lane, London on 1:28pm Mon 4 Feb 08
[quote][bold]roch1993[/bold] wrote:
Hey i am a 14 year old curenty from bournemouth and i thing it is terribal that children as young as ten that carnt got o shops to buy acohel or byu fags till there 18 has been given the right to have a posesionof a gun. i am not a fan of guns and that is not the reason i am not fond of guns but if u think it acturly is not good cause they could acserdently shot the rong thing bb guns yeh nothing els thanks byex[/bold] [/quote] I think this young man needs to go to school a bit more! This spelling is a sad indictment of today's standard of education.
roch1993 wrote:
Hey i am a 14 year old curenty from bournemouth and i thing it is terribal that children as young as ten that carnt got o shops to buy acohel or byu fags till there 18 has been given the right to have a posesionof a gun. i am not a fan of guns and that is not the reason i am not fond of guns but if u think it acturly is not good cause they could acserdently shot the rong thing bb guns yeh nothing els thanks byex
I think this young man needs to go to school a bit more! This spelling is a sad indictment of today's standard of education.
Posted by: 2Much, New Forest on 7:19am Tue 5 Feb 08
[quote][bold]john_screech[/bold] wrote:
"This is quite frightening"?
In what way?
Far better that kids are taught from an early age to respect firearms and learn to handle them safely.
I think you'll also find that shooting has one of the lowest accident rates of any participation sport. That doesn't happen by chance.
What is quite frightening is the alarmist and sensationalist reporting shown here. This report clearly fails to mention that anyone under the age of 15 may be granted a shotgun licence but the use of which must be supervised by someone over the age of 21.
The implication in this report is that a youngster can go out and get his or herself a gun and use it where ever and whenever they like.
That is clearly not the case.[/quote] Well put, Mr Screech!
john_screech wrote:
"This is quite frightening"?
In what way?
Far better that kids are taught from an early age to respect firearms and learn to handle them safely.
I think you'll also find that shooting has one of the lowest accident rates of any participation sport. That doesn't happen by chance.
What is quite frightening is the alarmist and sensationalist reporting shown here. This report clearly fails to mention that anyone under the age of 15 may be granted a shotgun licence but the use of which must be supervised by someone over the age of 21.
The implication in this report is that a youngster can go out and get his or herself a gun and use it where ever and whenever they like.
That is clearly not the case.
Well put, Mr Screech!
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